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Post by hunterjwizzard on Dec 28, 2021 0:57:04 GMT -5
Hi all, I'm back and its time to scratch the HW Itch.
I just recently completed construction on a "retro" gaming PC - slot1 PIII 550mhz/758mb of good old SD133 RAM and a "Voodoo3" graphics card, all running Windows 98 SE. I wanted to see what all my old favorite games would have looked like on a real gaming PC of the era, Hardwar included.
Now here's the difficult bit: I installed off of my ISOs(I do have original disks... somewhere...) install does fine, but the game will not run. If I try it with out of the box version it "starts" but I just get a black screen. If I install UIM 6 I get a "File not found" error for Hardman. I can understand if UIM6 won't work on 98.
Anyone got any suggestions? Just for initial launch I have it set to software rendering.
Ironic that it's easier to load on windows 10 than 98 lol
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Post by irjayjay on Jan 6, 2022 11:27:41 GMT -5
Oh wow, what a cool rig! Never thought of getting a retro rig running. Please tell me you're running an old IBM mechanical keyboard and a 15 inch CRT monitor too?
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Post by hunterjwizzzard on Jan 7, 2022 20:42:38 GMT -5
Oh wow, what a cool rig! Never thought of getting a retro rig running. Please tell me you're running an old IBM mechanical keyboard and a 15 inch CRT monitor too? I actually use a vintage 1984 model-M as my daily-driver(which is hooked up to the KVM). I'm using a modern screen(actually 4k) for the most part(and yes, Windows 98 will output a 4K signal if you ask it to) mostly so I can experience the old games in 1920x1080. I however have a 22" CRT waiting in the wings for when I have some space for it  But hye if you're interested in going old-school I can point you to the right parts. Its a lot of fun especially with the Voodoo3, its like getting to play all my old favorite games again for the first time! |
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Post by hunterjwizzzard on Jan 7, 2022 21:14:50 GMT -5
So the goal here is to see what Hardware looks like on a vintage 3dfx card - so far as I can tell, it *should* be supported. I'm attempting to launch on basic 2.04(loaded from a UK ISO file) and I get the following:
3DFX Error: 1024x768 is not a valid screen mode for your 3DFX card (Hardwar uses 2 screens plus a z-buffer).
I'm fairly new to these 3DFX cards(I never had an actual graphics card until the mid-2000s). I'm guessing though this is not a hardwar-specific issue.
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janskjaer
Junior Member
There's a War, and it ain't Easy.
Posts: 89 
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Post by janskjaer on Jan 8, 2022 3:42:37 GMT -5
Hmmmmmmm ..... seems my post was deleted after submitting it *and* reviewing it once posted. Posted just before yesterday's first post. My question about versioning was even answered!
From what I can remember typing:
There shouldn't be any issue with Hardwar on such hardware. I'm running Hardwar on my Dell Dimension XPS M200s (P1 200 MMX, 64Mb RAM, Win95, and with either a Rendition Verite V1000, PowerVR PCX2, or 3Dfx Voodoo Graphics).
I've also ran it on my selection of ASUS P3B-Fs and selection of different CPUs (Celeron 333 / P2 400 / P3 550) on Win98SE, with a 3Dlabs Permedia2.
It runs on my Chaintech 7VJL Apogee with my 3dfx Voodoo5 5500 AGP, which is running Win98SE and Win2000 SP4. Hardwar works on all of them.
- What version of Hardwar are you running? The retail version (F2.0)?
- When you have the black screen, do you still hear game sound? (the sound of a hangar from a saved game, or the beep of typing in a pilot name from a new game)
- Have you tried running in Glide? With the later 3dfx cards, Hardwar is actually more stable in Glide than software rendering.
- Are you running the stock version of DirectX that comes with Win98SE? version 6.1a?
- What set of drivers are you using for the Voodoo3 card?
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Post by hunterjwizzzard on Jan 9, 2022 23:18:25 GMT -5
So if I load UIM06 on win98 I get an error saying it can't find Hardman. Even if I launch the game from Hardman. This isn't hugely unexpected - UIM06 was released well after the death of windows 98.
- What version of Hardwar are you running? The retail version (F2.0)?
F2.0, base install
- When you have the black screen, do you still hear game sound? (the sound of a hangar from a saved game, or the beep of typing in a pilot name from a new game)
Turned my sound way up to test this one - yes I get sound, but only on software rendering! That click of Psycho Bob's cigarette lighter will be burned into my brain for the rest of my life.
- Have you tried running in Glide? With the later 3dfx cards, Hardwar is actually more stable in Glide than software rendering.
I do not have a "Glide"-supported card in the retro PC - the whole point of it was to try out 3DFX. I should go looking for a glide-mode card just for fun though.
For reference: the only options are Software, Power VR(no idea what that is), 3DFX, and Direct3D
And today I got it to work in direct3D!!!! I was unimpressed.
- Are you running the stock version of DirectX that comes with Win98SE? version 6.1a?
I loaded the version of DirectX found on the HW CD
- What set of drivers are you using for the Voodoo3 card?
I am using "v3-w9x-retail-1.04.00-jan27", a driver that will be 22 years old later this month. If there's a community for Voodoo graphics cards enthusiasts out there I'd love to find it.
So I did actually get the game to launch in Direct3D mode today and let's just say I less unimpressed. Looks worse than software rendering. The whole point of this experiment is to see what Hardwar looks like in 3DFX. If I just want to play, I have it working flawlessly on my windows 10 gaming PC.
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janskjaer
Junior Member
There's a War, and it ain't Easy.
Posts: 89
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Post by janskjaer on Jan 11, 2022 14:02:26 GMT -5
So if I load UIM06 on win98 I get an error saying it can't find Hardman. Even if I launch the game from Hardman. This isn't hugely unexpected - UIM06 was released well after the death of windows 98. - What version of Hardwar are you running? The retail version (F2.0)? F2.0, base install OK, I'm a little confused. So you've tried running Hardwar on the base install F2.0, then upgraded to UIM06, and tried running the game again? And in both scenarios, you receive the black screen? After installing F2.0, did you upgrade to U2.04, before installing UIM06? AFAIK, you must install U2.04 before upgrading to UIM06? Although, I could be wrong. When you hear Bob's lighter, mouse-click through several times, past the video and intro logos. Does the screen stay black? You can tell if you are at the 'New Pilot' screen by typing blindly. You will hear the "bleeping" of each key press as you enter a pilot name. But, you mentioned you have a Voodoo3 card!? Glide is 3dfx's native API. When you see the option, "3DFX", that is Glide. What happens when you try running the game with that? If you've somehow managed to "successfully" install the DirectX version from the Hardwar CD, then that could be your problem. The version of DirectX included on the original CD images is version 5.0. It's older than the version of DirectX included with Windows 98SE. Black screens were often a source of DirectX incompatibilities. Even in software, chances are, you are experiencing a black screen, because you've installed an older DirectDraw component (version 5.0) over your OS' original (6.1a). To resolve this, try installing DirectX 7.0 and see if this fixes the issue. That driver is WHQL certified for Windows 98 SE, but it is one of the later DirectX 7 drivers - and you don't have DirectX 7 installed. I recommend installing DirectX 7.0 or 7.0a to use that driver. Or, if you prefer to use the original DirectX that came with Win98SE (6.1a), then I would recommend v1.01.00 of this driver. Other Voodoo3 drivers can be found here, but I recommend sticking to the official 3dfx drivers for better compatibility. That could be because of installing DirectX 5 on Windows 98SE, if that's even possible. Perhaps you can take some in-game screenshots and upload them here. |
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Post by Pilot on Jan 11, 2022 23:30:24 GMT -5
So if I load UIM06 on win98 I get an error saying it can't find Hardman. Even if I launch the game from Hardman. This isn't hugely unexpected - UIM06 was released well after the death of windows 98. You could try unzipping the installer, and overwriting the files. I'm not sure exactly where the rock and met BMP files would go though, presumably with the EXEs, but they are not in the same folder in the installer. The installer seems to be a "smart" unzipper, so I assume it checks the registry to find the location of Hardman. In which case if you are comfortable with it you can modify the registry [winkey+R then type regedit, if winkey+r doesn't work use RUN located in the start menu (somewhere) or right-click desktop add a shortcut type regedit the follow the prompts.] (Be CAREFUL though!) maybe janskjaer could post the registry info, though the W95 version maybe different from W98SE? I have to say, I still prefer the original fog colors, fog distance, and that unnerving feeling of flying through Titan with a valuable cargo and seeing a moths on the radar. It is a good thing that targeting them wasn't a provocation. Hahaha. If you just have a black screen after launch that reminds me of not having the disk in. . . (RANT->) I happened to drop my original CD 1 back in ~2000 and (what were the odds) if rolled onto and slanted on my desk chairs roller section and as I started to roll back to pick it up, my foot snapped the disk. Thankfully after time went by I found an ISO, then was found a copy in a Big Lots of all places. But yeah, trying to start the game without the disk or even disk two was a failure, though I think it did ask to have disk inserted? |
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Post by hunterjwizzzard on Jan 12, 2022 13:41:56 GMT -5
Almost the exact same thing happened to me!!! LOL!! Fortunately by that time I had made my own backups of the ISOs. I believe I still have the cracked disk one floating around here somewhere. Then about 5 years ago I went and impulse-bought a new copy on eBay for $60. That one however I've kept sealed. So hey, if anyone sold a copy of HardWar on eBay in the mid 2010s, I'm your buyer. Anyway, regarding the original purpose of this thread, I've been quite ill the past several days. I promise I will get back to this project soon. |
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Post by m0u53r on Sept 1, 2022 22:33:37 GMT -5
Hunterjwizzard, I hope you are doing well...I thought I should mention got the Hardwar on old hardware itch too. But I went with an old laptop. I found a Toshiba P25 with a Geforce FX go5700. Dual booting win98 and WinXP. The Ian Martin UIM patches require DirectX 9, I think that might be your problem getting uim06 working. If you are planning on using Glide, the latest version that supports it is UIM01 For active 3dfx communities, you might look at 3dfxzone.it I think someone there recently modded a driver for the voodoo5 to work with modern displays. I looked into using nglide as a glide wrapper on windows xp. Their website says to use win95 Compatability mode. www.zeus-software.com/downloads/nglide/compatibility So if you're still having issues trying to get glide to work, maybe give that setting a try. I hope some of this info helps... Also with a voodoo3 be sure you don't use the secondary display setting... that is reserved for add-on 3d accelerator cards like the voodoo2. PowerVR was a certain kind of video card and it rendered the game differently and required its own API I read somewhere that software mode is only stable at 640x480...but that might just be on slower processors |
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janskjaer
Junior Member
There's a War, and it ain't Easy.
Posts: 89
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Post by janskjaer on Sept 27, 2023 9:10:46 GMT -5
So the goal here is to see what Hardware looks like on a vintage 3dfx card - so far as I can tell, it *should* be supported. I'm attempting to launch on basic 2.04(loaded from a UK ISO file) and I get the following: 3DFX Error: 1024x768 is not a valid screen mode for your 3DFX card (Hardwar uses 2 screens plus a z-buffer). I'm fairly new to these 3DFX cards(I never had an actual graphics card until the mid-2000s). I'm guessing though this is not a hardwar-specific issue. I'm re-visiting this one as I am now also experiencing the same error: 3DFX Error: 1024x768 is not a valid screen mode for your 3DFX card (Hardwar uses 2 screens plus a z-buffer). I'm using my Glidebox, which is a period-correct machine: - Athlon XP 2700+ - 256MB RAM - Windows 98SE - 2x 3Dfx Voodoo2 12MB in SLI When selecting 640x480 or 800x600 resolutions for the '3DFX' display option, this is not an issue. I've experienced this on F2.0, U1.0 and the U3.0 betas. Despite hunterjwizzzard's encounter, this is not a problem on U2.04 if you select 3DFX Glide3. u2.04 is the only version that allows to select between '3DFx Glide2' and '3DFx Glide3', which the latter allows for the higher resolution to be used on a Voodoo2. Technically, so should Glide2, but for whatever reason, it does not. This however is a regression issue in the U3.00 betas, as there is only one display option for 3DFX, and the Software Refinery chose to go with Glide2. I tried to circumvent this issue by removing \WINDOWS\System\Glide2x.dll or copying and renaming the \WINDOWS\System\Glide3x.dll to \WINDOWS\System\Glide2x.dll, but that then creates the following error: 3DFX Error: Could not open Glide2x.dll or Glide3x.dll,This is an ambiguous error message, as Glide3 is clearly present, but Hardware refuses to use it if Glide2 is not present. If 1024x768 3DFX with another Hardware version is required, there is a current workaround albeit a hacky one. 1. Install and enable HardLuck. 2. Enable the Developer's Info checkbox in the 'Misc.' tab. Somehow, this does not carry out the same 3dfx Glide check, and continues on. The caveat is that the FMV's will be displayed in windowed-mode and not full-screen, but the rest of the gameplay will be in full-screen 1024x768. I verified that it is using Glide2 in 1024x768 because (a) my display tells me the resolution and refresh rate (b) I have a 3dfx watermark display when Glide3 is being used and (c) all screenshots taken (CTRL+K) are blue when using the 3Dfx Glide API. Direct3D, PowerVR SGL and Software display all colours in their screenshots correctly. |
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